You know like, you know I don't know what you're doing. I'm interested to a certain extent.

No no.

But, rather than rather than like engage on a rather than try and try and find a right or a wrong about it it's like fuck that you're doing it and you have a kind of fuck you about you and it's the same with A and B and C you know and I hope myself and D that it's there that commitment to don't know what it is fully but I'm going to try it anyway that's what's important. And that's what you have to give space for. It's not that I don't appreciate you you know kind of like saying

Well no no no no that's

asking me if that's weird but I don't fully know how to

that's

read it myself.

that's perfect. I mean, I totally agree with you. I like completely and totally agree with you and I think you're absolutely right. And I think that's absolutely the context within which you have to work. Especially when you're at this point in your in your that's not true. At any point. At any point you should always work that way. You know it should be. It is not an intellectual process in an analytic sense but there is there is for me there is like a

there is a balance.

that's that's part of what came up in that conversation about your work originally which is just about like you know at a certain that's what the search for ground the fact that we acknowledge that there is a search is to me not is discipline

Yeah

is context is medium independent it's not about architecture as building it's about anything. And if we want to call it architecture, be it built, inhabitable whatever or not it still has to do with that question and perhaps you're establishing something else - which I think is really valid which is really important to balance that kind of questioning but the point is that there is a dialectic between those two and that's the field

Yes

within you have to work

Yeah yeah I agree. I agree. [Pause] Really it's also it's also to do with a kind of sensitivity to your skill at dealing with [Pause] How you engage that dialectic is quite a delicate question because there are some people who you can just like go in and say 'what the fuck are you doing' but what I'm trying to say is just that there's a no like you have to like feel your way round that one because [Pause]

Yeah. Yeah it also has to do with like how can you simply push your way of working and like not ask the methodology questions but make but also give it a kind of positive reinforcement or kind of positive energy it has to continue and we know that it has to continue with out too much of a kind of intellectual questioning it has to perpetuate it has to go on. I mean that kind of push and pull it's almost it's like a rope and you're letting it

Yeah, yeah I agree

So it's not it's not so simple and to me there's something about and I haven't figured this out but there's something about really being able to bring the ground of discipline of a discipline being defined by a medium. And this is something this is something where I feel like that girl E who is so discouraged and she is so fucking depressed but she is so smart and she understands that question I think more clearly than a lot of people but like that's something that like that I just think is like it's really present in her work and she's really great to talk to about it but just in general I think it's I think it's crucial I think

What is

I mean why building? Why especially in the context of a studio like this you know we don't. It's absolutely completely projection. We project these projects on to the world and as a kind of screen between you know me as an academic basically and the world itself you know how do these projects activate that as an other as a context - of the city or the context like of thought in general so really these projects are always built in the sense that they are viewed and they are imagined and that process does not have to necessarily do with you know spatial inhabitation or the imagination of spatial inhabitation that's my like that's something that I feel like really has to be and this is almost just like a specific instance of how like a process can be pushed but I think that's all that's another question that I want to come up more. But in your project early on and that was something I was trying to say to you was this does not have to become a building these set of relationships this way in which you're working that's being developed could very well continue to be developed along those line and its propositions and you know hypotheses about things could be expressed in many ways it doesn't have to become about this kind of tectonics you can develop your own tectonics.

Mm.

And that to me as something as a generation in general could be a very important project to complete or to not complete but try to suggest.

Yeah well I think that practices interdisciplinary practice is all is the way to go it's all I'm going to do

But I think I and you know that I think that it's completely feasible like with that kind of reassessment of architecture's scale and its relationship to its to its purpose and to its history is absolutely on the table but also in a completely realistic and manifestable way. We don't there are there are way to make these things work. It doesn't have to be an interiority it doesn't have to be like F or something it's a beautiful i mean it's like it's a beautiful oeuvre or something but it doesn't like but it doesn't have to be books you know that kind of suggestion that kind of the poignancy of that kind of work doesn't have to just be academic and I think that to me that's something that as a group could I just feel like that's like a that's like a there's there's a in a field of things that could be taken out of a discipline or out of the discipline of architecture like something that was completely left behind by those people not in a way not like it had to be but I think like F could have very well made those things work in another way perhaps by somehow being a gallery artist or something like that you know just in a way that he begins to engage more the populace, right the loss of that connection to me is like a loss of its ability to really work and that like I think that has to be on the table as a possible criticism even in an imagined even in a projected project. you know it doesn't mean that again it doesn't mean it has to be about real things but its like how will it become viewed how will it become something that even as an imagined thing has an effect has a continuation or just a dialectic between its relationship i mean even as a physical thing too I mean I measure my body against your work I stand and I look at it and if its on a wall how does that work I mean its assumed there's all these assumed relationships here and I think that's just I think that's just ludicrous. It's insane.

F just holds his place. Like some kind of foul ghost. Fucker's still alive. It's like all these

F and G are like are like together.

Yeah

And it's such a strange thing you know like there are all these relationships that we're aware of but I mean it's just ridiculously political it's so strange.

Yeah but like the you know someone walked past my project I don't know if you've seen that cloud thing I've suspended on the side of it that I painted like a sunflower. You're going to love this. [Laughs] Someone walked passed it and said 'That's not an architectural element' and I went 'Why?' and the best they could come up with was 'How's it going to stand up?' and it's like: Fuck the cross, fuck the minus fuck the division and fuck you all.